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Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think about
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Foreverchang
Young Hoofer
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:12 pm
Posts: 21
Main Role: Performer
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 Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think about I apologize for the weird title, but I couldn't think of another way to say it. Anyway this is kind of a "rant" page. Examples: I hate it when people say Javert is evil becase ... (extremely angry rant following that) Just let it all out!
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| Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:24 pm |
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Quique
Broadway Legend / MdN Veteran
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:17 am
Posts: 4004
Location: Bitterville
Current Obsession: MUSIC in MUSICals
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo I hate it when people only look at what's on the surface and take with them the idea that Javert is evil, when the musical says absolutely nothing of the sort and makes it very clear that he is a troubled man with unbending principals which are the product of self-loathing and a misguided quest for redemption. The poor puppy is misunderstood half the time by lazy audiences who are waiting to be WoWed by high notes, high cost gimmicks, and even higher volume.
I can't believe "saintly" Valjean cutting him loose at the barricade does nothing to clue-in most of those who say he's EVIL, EVIL, EVIL.
STUPID, STUPID, STUPID.
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| Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:26 am |
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xXMoonOwlXx
Chorus Member
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 3:04 pm
Posts: 56
Current Obsession: Les Miserables
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo It really bugs me when people say that Cosette is spoiled, dumb, or mean, because there really is no indication of that. I'm all for people having opinions on characters and all, and I don't mind people who don't like Cosette because they think she's cliche or predictable, but I hate it when people will say untrue things about the character they just don't like. Cosette is upper-middle class, but that doesn't make her spoiled. She knows that not everyone has the life that she has. Valjean takes her with him when he gives alms. Sure, she asks for new dresses, but there was no indication that she was going to flip if she didn't get new clothes. Cosette is said to be well-educated and intelligent. Yeah, she's a bit naive, but so would any girl who's had limited interaction with anyone besides her father and the girls and nuns at the convent. And she never does anything mean! Where does that one come from?!
Sorry, I'm a fangirl. Just ignore me.
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| Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:38 pm |
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Quique
Broadway Legend / MdN Veteran
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:17 am
Posts: 4004
Location: Bitterville
Current Obsession: MUSIC in MUSICals
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo Oh my, something crawled up ma butt last night, eh?
Boy was I in a foul mood, LOL. At any rate, I meant what I said up until the "stupid audiences" thing. I've argued in the past that, while it isn't accurate to dismiss Javert as a villain or reduce his motivations and intentions to an inherent evil, he is a threat to Valjean and unjustly so. So he may not be evil but he is trouble. And we really want Valjean and Cosette to live happy, fulfilling lives but that'd be impossible with the Inspector lurking 'round the corner. 
So, yeah, people aren't stoopid for saying that, but just misinformed or they jump to conclusions.
As for the Cosette vs. Eponine dead horse, you'll find such ideas are shared mostly among naive tweens who also think the show's logo is Eponine's mug.
*nothing crawling up his caboose this day*
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| Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:33 pm |
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EponineAddict
Fresh Face
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:37 pm
Posts: 4
Current Obsession: Les Miserables, Eponine
Main Role: Performer
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo I hate it when an actress performing Eponine makes her seem like a stupid, love sick idiot. She has more depth than that. Also, I hate it when people make her seem perfect. In the books, she's slightly insane, and that's the way I like her. 
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| Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:17 pm |
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costerluver
Chorus Member
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:35 pm
Posts: 64
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo There are two things that bug me. When people claim that Les Mis was written by Andrew Lloyd Weber (starting to rage just thinking about it). Another thing is when people are under the impression that Marius loved both Cossette and Eponine and had to choose between the two. LOVING EPONINE NEVER EVEN OCCURS TO MARIUS ONCE!!!!
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| Sat Dec 03, 2011 8:50 am |
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Vanessa20
Broadway Legend
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 1:06 pm
Posts: 800
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo Here's a 'Les Mis pet peeves' thread that I started long ago: viewtopic.php?t=76346To this one I'll add: *Fantine actresses who seem perfectly healthy throughout their part until (and sometimes even during) "Come to Me." Ugh. I'd rather see her die from a kick in the vagina (thank you, Quique, for that evocative phrase) than have her seem to die inexplicably. *People who think Eponine's death makes Marius realize that she was the one he should have loved all along and fills him with remorse for having chosen Cosette. *"Fans" of the show who seem to hate it. I've seen a surprising number of people who "like" the show insist that Herbert Kretzmer's lyrics are terrible, that the characters are cardboard cutouts, that Hugo's message is totally lost, that the whole thing is a cheap, sappy melodrama that wouldn't even be popular if it weren't based on such a rich, magnificent novel, etc. No offense to anyone here who agrees with those statements: if I had read the book before seeing the musical, I might even agree with some of them. But since I love the musical for itself, not just as an extension of the book, it bugs me to see it bashed like that.
Last edited by Vanessa20 on Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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| Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:06 am |
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jdeng
Off-Broadway Lead
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:39 pm
Posts: 239
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo ... because the majority of the audience love Eponine more than Cosette, and Marius is the most feasible medium to convey their love ... lol [= lots of love] ...
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| Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:15 pm |
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Quique
Broadway Legend / MdN Veteran
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:17 am
Posts: 4004
Location: Bitterville
Current Obsession: MUSIC in MUSICals
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo  | | | | Vanessa20 wrote: Here's a 'Les Mis pet peeves' thread that I started long ago: viewtopic.php?t=76346To this one I'll add: *Fantine actresses who seem perfectly healthy throughout their part until (and sometimes even during) "Come to Me." Ugh. I'd rather see her die from a kick in the vagina (thank you, Quique, for that evocative phrase) than have her seem to die inexplicably. *People who think Eponine's death makes Marius realize that she was the one he should have loved all along and fills him with remorse for having chosen Cosette. *"Fans" of the show who seem to hate it. I've seen a surprising number of people who "like" the show insist that Herbert Kretzmer's lyrics are terrible, that the characters are cardboard cutouts, that Hugo's message is totally lost, that the whole thing is a cheap, sappy melodrama that wouldn't even be popular if it weren't based on such a rich, magnificent novel, etc. No offense to anyone here who agrees with those statements: if I had read the book before seeing the musical, I might even agree with some of them. But since I love the musical for itself, not just as an extension of the book, it bugs me to see it bashed like that. | | | | |
I wholeheartedly agree, except for Fantine's death part.
As for the "fans" who hate the musical, I thought I was the only one who noticed those. I get a kick out of the ones who want the whole novel on stage, down to the tiniest detail. It doesn't, so, therefore the novel is waaaayyyy better. Or the musical is "wrong" because it didn't carbon copy the novel and instead went with adaptation. The nerve. I think we have all said aspects of the novel should have made it into the musical adaptation. Nothing wrong there. It gets dumb when something ineffective is favored over the more effective adaptation just because it's true to the novel. That's all fine and good, but is it compatible with the musical version? Does it lose something in its transfer to a different medium? People who care about the art form don't just accept anything. There's an art to it. It goes without saying the novel is a beautifully written work with many, many layers. I don't see why the musical has to compete with it.
The people so preoccupied with fulfilling shallow expectations of "type." Valjean MUST have a rough, older gentleman sound of Colm Wilkinson or else he IS NOT Valjean and sucks royally--something Gary Morris has always been judged by. It's incredible people claim he cannot sing and they get that from the fact he sounds nothing like Colm. You could think he's not the definitive Valjean, just don't base it on shallow details that have nothing to do with characterization and are more the actor's own unique traits he can't avoid.
These temporarily put me in a bad mood because it's laziness and willful simple-mindedness at its worst...
"I prefer the OLC recording because that's the one I was exposed to first."
"You say Colm sucks, yet, he is the original for a reason."
"The new tour orchestrations are more orchestrated. The old version had lots of synthesizer."
"Nobody can ever be better than the original cast because they created the roles."
"The show ACTUALLY doesn't NEED a revolve!"
"You must love the original orchestrations because you've become attached to them...like glue. As to WHAT caused/inspired this attachment? Er...I don't know. It's the glue. Ya, that's it. It is high time you rid yourself of this toxic adhesive." 
"Hey, MY experience was different than yours and I can't, for the life of me, see things from your perspective. Therefore, you must be mad." 
"These people are losers and scum. The sex shows how nasty they are, which makes it darker, therefore better."
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| Thu Dec 29, 2011 7:24 am |
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xXMoonOwlXx
Chorus Member
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 3:04 pm
Posts: 56
Current Obsession: Les Miserables
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo Ugh. OLC fans get annoying. But that's sort of every musical though. Phantom and Wicked have cast/recording wars like you wouldn't believe. and I personally really like Gary MorrisAlso, the slutshaming of the female characters. Not just the mindless Cosette bashing, but people who say Fantine "deserved it" for having an illegitimate child and that Eponine was probably a "filthy whore" so who cares if her life sucked.  And another thing, not so much about Les Mis but about the fans. The people who claim that half of the fans are elitists really bug me. I mean, I get intimidated by some of the fans because of how smart they are and how not-smart I am, but their intelligence doesn't make them "elitists" or horrible people. They're just very knowledgeable and they're very passionate about Les Mis. And it's not like this is a Les Mis only issue. Every fandom has elitists. (I can probably be classified as an elistist in one of my other fandoms actually...  ) Some of the supposed "elitist" fans are actually really nice!
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| Thu Dec 29, 2011 9:42 am |
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Quique
Broadway Legend / MdN Veteran
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:17 am
Posts: 4004
Location: Bitterville
Current Obsession: MUSIC in MUSICals
Main Role: Fan
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo This "elite" business is really the result of naive members who happen upon fandoms that discuss the novel and go around trying to emulate them. The fandom in question usually involves Abaisse, who themselves, are not guilty of any "elite" nonsense and are indeed very friendly people. It never fails to impress me the great attitude and humility of the site's administration/owner in addressing the forum--she really makes sure conflicts are resolved as quickly as possible and is very thorough so you know she cares. Still, you get people who call them "elite" or who are intimidated by them. Um...OK. They read and comprehended a novel. How is that "elite"? LOL. Yes, I agree most of them have good heads on their shoulders but that's not something that came with reading a novel.
Oh, and it warmed my heart so that I felt all fuzzy inside when some weirdo once created a thread for people who "hate the musical," assuming this elite snob thing I'm referring to, only to be shot down by the whole site for going into a forum that celebrates the musical and novel and creating such a thread. And people say I'M a loon? Haha.
Haven't been over there (Abaisse) for a while. Will probably crash the place later and see what's up with the ladies. 
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| Thu Dec 29, 2011 10:54 am |
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Thom_Boyer
Tony Winner
Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2004 9:51 pm
Posts: 290
Location: Somerville, NJ
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Re: Things that Peeve You that Other People Say or Think abo But I happen to really *like* the OLC... Of course, I'm not about to go to war over it either.
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| Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:21 pm |
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